86 900 Street / Track Project

[Luke]

How did the hill climb go? Josh said you had some good runs on saturday? I was just about to jump into the car yesterday to go check it out, but then the downpours started....

[SwedeSport]

The event went well.

The Team Swedesport / Infinite Graphics Saab 900 was nearly maintenance free all weekend, except for the quart of Mobil 1 that was sacrificed to the tailpipe via the leaky valve guides. Tire pressure adjustments were the order of the weekend as we tried to find the sweet spot for the Kumho Ecsta xs's. Complicating this matter was the extreme changes in the conditions of the hill and the weather. Saturday was dry with reasonable grip, while Sunday was run during the intermittent downpours. Those leaky Brittish cars didnt help matters with the amount of oil they deposited on the surface. People on foot were having traction issues.

I managed a best time of 149.742 seconds on the 2.3 mile course on Saturday. A full 7 seconds off the pace for SMF. Being my first ever hillclimb, and due to my unfamiliarity with the course I drove conservatively in an effort to complete my first event without incident. (Rookies are NOT allowed to have ANY incidents for 3 events). Round 1 is now successfully behind me. Sunday was a great learning experience running a pushy underpowered car with an open diff. It was a great exercise in car control as it was a challenge to power out of the turns without plowing off course into a tree stump.

The 8v NA is a bit underpowered compared to the competition, which was an issue on the tighter turns where I had to slow way down. I also was quite timid on some of the faster parts of the course. I can pick up quite a bit of time once I master the section between 4 and 7. I was feathering the throttle there all weekend, whereas the veterans are flat out all the way. Turn 6, referred to as "Oh Shit" routinely sees speeds of up to 125. I was just topping 85 leading up to it, and would lift throttle to scrub off about 10 mph. Turn 10 on up to the finish line is another fast section, with a blind jump that drops out to the left. Nothing but trees and rocks on the right shoulder, no guardrail or walls. I would scrub off speed before the crest and stay out to the right since it was a decreasing radius left. the apex is actually further down the hill and if you are too far left its not gonna be pretty. I would spot the apex, drop the hammer and keep it floored across the finish line. I was just shy of 100 mph crossing the stripe. Maybe next year my pussy wont hurt so much and my foot will get heavier.

Im really tired from the weekend, and really have not had a chance to sort the pics and vids from the weekend. Once I look at all the footage Ill try to post some here. Gonna run the PHA track trial in two weeks on the Jefferson Circuit at Summit Point. After that Ill probably only run a few autocrosses before winter. Already gathering steam for the next phase of the project. Plans include ditching CIS in favor of carbs. Id like to weld the diff in the current trans that is in the car , or put together another unit with an LSD. The box in the car right now is a P.O.S. 91 S trans with worn synchros. I want to do something about the diff, but dont want to spend money to do it.


Thanks to all the folks on this forum for the advice that helped me get the car done.

[DrewP]

I've been curious to try a Phantom Grip since they're so cheap, while not optimal it probably would've helped in the rain.

Sounds like a lot of fun, keep it up!

Best,
Drew

[Crazyswede]

I've been curious to try a Phantom Grip since they're so cheap, while not optimal it probably would've helped in the rain.

Sounds like a lot of fun, keep it up!

Best,
Drew

We ran one in Geoff's rally car and while it isn't fantastic it was better then stock open diff. The phantom grip just puts pressure on the spider gears so that it removes some of the slip. If I had to guess I'd say a phantom grip allowed about 10 or 15 percent more power to go to each wheel...maybe more when its first put in. I seem to remember that there were a lot of metal filings that came out when the transmission oil was changed...due to the phantom grip rubbing on the spiders.

As I recall a new Phantom grip was about $400. If it were me I would just save my money and get a quaiffe for another $400 or so. The performance will be a lot better in the long run and if you decide to sell it down the road you are more likely to regain some of your investment. Used Phantom grips don't bring in a lot of cash.

[Luke]

I used a phantom grip. Like Seth said its better than nothing and does seem to help even out the power to each wheel on the street. I have one I could sell for cheap and its even got the uprated springs.

[airsweden]

Nice, sounds like a good first time out. You managed to roll with the punches in the rain and still come home home in one piece. I sure Its different for everybody but I need to compete at least once a month in some sort of race to stay moderately comfortable behind the wheel "flat out". I've run the phantom grip in few cars, not worth the time and money IMO.

[Luke]

I sure Its different for everybody but I need to compete at least once a month in some sort of race to stay moderately comfortable behind the wheel "flat out". .

Thats one reason I am really happy to be back to daily driving a C900. Its basically like driving my rally car without the safety equipment. Even if you can't go 10/10 its just be used to the basic dynamics and feedback of the chassis that really helps.

[SwedeSport]

I take it that welding the diff is out of the question? I'm buying a f150 this week. Ill drive that to work, and drag the Saab to the track. Ill still keep the Saab street legal and drive it to local events, car shows etc, but its past the point of practical as a DD. And it will last longer as a toy.

[Crazyswede]

welding the diff together is a bad idea....this will lead to broken CV joints, broken axle shafts, broken transmissions, not to mention crazy understeering in corners. Plus it hammers the ring and pinion into iblivion...maybe Mr Teresco has some pictures of the welded diff that was in his crash box.

[airsweden]

Plus it hammers the ring and pinion into iblivion...maybe Mr Teresco has some pictures of the welded diff that was in his crash box.

My Dad has a crashbox too?

[DrewP]

I thought I remembered seeing Phantom Grips for the $250-ish range?


***These guys have one listed for the C900 for $289

http://www.dynamicturbo.com/products/drive-train/differential/phantom-grip-lsd-conversion-kits.html



Drew

[airsweden]

not worth it..... even if its free.

[SwedeSport]

Maybe I just beat this box as is until she blows, and work on getting a real LSD installed in a trans, and ready for when it happens. Luke, how much for the used phantom grip you have? I plan mostly paved events but not out of the question to try a rallycross. Any suggestions for which diff to pick?

[Crazyswede]

Maybe I just beat this box as is until she blows, and work on getting a real LSD installed in a trans, and ready for when it happens. Luke, how much for the used phantom grip you have? I plan mostly paved events but not out of the question to try a rallycross. Any suggestions for which diff to pick?

you might be able to get another group buy together for the clutch pack diffs we got through gripper. Might be cheaper this time since he has made 10 so far...might not be cheaper. But I bet you could find a group to go in on them. We each ended up paying about $1000.

[Jordan]

I bet the exchange rate is a lot better now though too.